Post details: Eighteen reasons why in a single verse?


Permalink 01:34:03 am, Categories: GraceHead teaching, By Trent, 357 words   English (US)

Eighteen reasons why in a single verse?

by Trent (originally posted March 24, 2006)

Luke 13:1-5 (NIV)
Repent or Perish
Now there were some present at that time who told Jesus about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mixed with their sacrifices. Jesus answered, "Do you think that these Galileans were worse sinners than all the other Galileans because they suffered this way? I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish. Or those eighteen who died when the tower in Siloam fell on them—do you think they were more guilty than all the others living in Jerusalem? I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all [likewise] perish."

Not one person or two, but eighteen had a city tower crumble and fall on them. It was unanimous; all died. This was Jesus' illustration of judgement of unrepentence. The strange thing is why there was not a single man out of all eighteen that consciously moaning in agony.

Could Jesus have found an illustration of unending torment? I suppose He could have, if he wanted to support the modern interpretation of "perish."

Church-goers have all heard that to perish does not mean die, it means staying alive while in misery and discomfort ... like burning alive but not being consumed, just feeling the heat in agony. But, "perish" from a biblical standpoint has always meant one thing - death ... not ongoing, but final and complete death.

In this passage Jesus gives us eighteen reasons to believe the truth, becuase eighteen people were caught under the tower, but not a single one of them was in unending couscious torment and agony. In fact, eighteen out of eighteen were snuffed out.

So if unrepentence is your thing, and unbelief suits you ... I am not annihilationhere to change your mind ... I'm just here to explain what lies ahead.

Wide is the road that leads to [torment?]
No ... it has always been ...
Wide is the road that leads to destruction.

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Comment from: Pam [Member]
A point of logic that I could never make fit is if the lost are spiritually dead and need rebirth in Christ to be alive spiritually, how can they suffer eternal torment in the spirit for eternity?

Permalink 03/24/06 @ 10:51
Comment from: lisa [Visitor]
Could it be we're trying to understand a Godly/Spiritual realm with carnal/flesh mind?
How does a spirit suffer to begin with? How does a spirit live? Does it eat? Does it have nerve endings that will feel pain? Does it have muscle tissue that will draw up in agony? Does it have neurons and synapses? One Bible teacher put it this way: Stop trying to put flesh and blood on Spirit.

Gang.. these are things that are beyond the scope of humanity. I would also submit that these thought lines are a red herring. A topic that leads us off the main idea. Christ gives us Life;
To be honest, I would much rather spend my time looking at the One that gives Life, instead of straining to see what's in the darkness, which is something I cannot comprehend in my finite human mind. But something I can do--is to trust God to work out the details of His realm that He created.
Permalink 03/24/06 @ 23:29
Comment from: caucazhin [Visitor]
This has nothing to do with the subject but I am leaving a link to a excellent message.PEACE 2 U all.
Galatians 2:16-21 - Justification By Faith Alone Part 1
March 26, 2006 KWVE Radio Program
Permalink 03/26/06 @ 17:57
Comment from: lenbenhear [Member] ·
I have just a couple quick comments that kind of sum up my thoughts on this one:

1)GOD IS NOT a sadist.

2)GOD IS NOT a torturer.

3)GOD IS MERCIFUL and JUST and GOOD, ... (as they say) "all the time." (!)

Sounds to me like the tares are "gathered in bundles and burned." ... the wheat are brought into THE FATHER'S place of safety and good-keeping.

And what does "perish" "burned" and "everlasting destruction" mean? - just what it says and implies most clearly. - that and nothing more.

PRAISE YOU, JESUS: A MOST WONDERFUL and Merciful GOD and Saviour !
Permalink 11/02/07 @ 15:32
Comment from: Editor of Free the Church [Visitor] ·
Eternal torment is a biblical truth. How it occurs is frequently misunderstood. The story of the tower of Siloam has nothing to do with eternal torment. Jesus is referring to an historical event where 18 people died in an accident to make the point that tragedy is not necessarily the result of a specific sin. He further points out that all have sinned and all will perish in the end if they don't repent. The question is, repent of what? Hell is not the place of eternal torment, but the Lake of Fire. No one will go into the Lake of Fire until after the White Throne Judgment. The Lake of Fire was not made for man, but Satan and his fallen angels. But all who refuse to accept the grace of God through Jesus Christ are choosing to follow Satan. Jesus said, those who are not for us are against us.
Permalink 01/29/08 @ 09:04
Comment from: Trent [Member] ·
Dear editor,
You said: """and all will perish in the end if they don't repent."""
Yes. All will perish if they don't repent. The Bible is clear on this.
Name one person that is conscience, awake, and thoughtfully live due to the fact that they perished.

Just one.

Do you believe that all souls are immortal? Do you believe that Jesus was bluffing when He said "fear the one that can destroy your soul?"
Do you believe that every man has "eternal" life ... some in paradise and others in misery? If so, what basis do you have for claiming that the unredeemed have eternal life?

I await your reply.


Ripening for the harvest,
Permalink 01/29/08 @ 10:19
Comment from: Susan Geitner [Visitor]
I have never heard this concept that the damned don't suffer eternally, so it is very foreign to what I'd been taught. I am currently investigating what you say, and, so far, have found it to be entirely possible, much to my surprise. For instance, Matthew 7:13 which talks about wide is the path that leads to "destruction" can also read "utterly destroyed" and "suffering loss." I am continuing to research all reference to the fate of unbelievers and original text with it's meaning. So, while I'm not yet 100% sure of your statements, I am seeking GOD'S truth on the matter through His Word which will confirm or disprove your position. I will walk in His truth and am NEVER married to doctrine of men. So stay tuned! Thank you for sharing your views. =)
Permalink 10/08/10 @ 08:20
Comment from: Trent [Member] ·
Hi Susan!
I made this little video a while back .. I'm just reading from the Bible and picked some of the most common verses that talk about the damned / damnation. I hope you take the 5 minutes or so to watch it:
Ripening for the harvest,
Permalink 10/08/10 @ 11:44

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