Post details: Did Jesus Ever Have a Migraine Headache???


Permalink 06:46:41 pm, Categories: Announcements [A], 2726 words   English (US)

Did Jesus Ever Have a Migraine Headache???

Was Jesus ever ill? It is written, that 'I was sick and you visited Me.' And it is hard to imagine that He could be scourged and crucified but never suffered a migraine. Provided that Jesus was ill as we are, then this would undo all the teaching on health and wealth and prosperity that infects the minds of the materialistic audience of such teachers.

That is what I USED to wonder about ... but not any more thanks to this ...


6/26/07 From Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ -
A Letter Given to Timothy, For Trent and For All Those Who Have Ears to Hear
Whatsoever You Have Done to the Least of These, My Children, Assuredly I Tell You, You Have Done It, Even Unto Me, Their Father, Says the Lord Your Redeemer

Question asked by Timothy, for Trent. Trent asks, "Was Jesus ever ill? It is written, that 'I was sick and you visited Me.' And it is hard to imagine that He could be scourged and crucified but never suffered a migraine. Provided that Jesus was ill as we are, then this would undo all the teaching on health and wealth and prosperity that infects the minds of the materialistic audience of such teachers."

This is what the Lord says to His servant:
Trent, My beloved, you seek Me, and this is very good. Continue in Me, with all zealousness, and in the times to come shall I bring you riches of the kind you have not known, of the kind that shall bring a multitude into My joy. Seek on, and serve Me in all patience and steadfastness of faith, with all long-suffering for those who know not Me and resist My Word. For I am not in them, for they do stifle My Spirit and have yet to receive of My fullness, though they have spoken in My name and confessed a good confession before men. Yet in their heart, of which I know, they have not confessed; neither have they let go of offenses; neither have they forgiven even everyone their sins, which have been wrought against them; neither have they given up that which I require; neither, in their weakness, has My strength been made perfect in them. For they go their own way, and closely adhere to all doctrines of men and the churches, endeavoring to teach others on My behalf, where in they go astray and do greatly err. For that which they have wrought in the Word, according to the traditions of men, is a rewriting of the Word spoken in Truth, of which none shall change. And so, they have endeavored to teach Me and not others. For if they taught others, according to that doctrine which is true, then, by this, they would know that the teacher, who has received of Me and of those gifts given by My own Spirit, teaches not by speaking, but by listening and by example, walking beside Me, holding My hand. And then, when those with sincere hearts come inquiring of Me, then, those who are given to teach, shall only speak that which I, Myself, have spoken to them. And those who are not given to hear, and wish to teach others of Me, even these, if they be wise in the Word, by the reading, and have received understanding, say only that which is written in the Scriptures of Truth, and search the Scriptures according to how I lead them in the edification of those who came before them in the asking. I am the Master, having never ceased from being with My beloved...yea, I am with them always, even to the end of this age.
Here is wisdom: Apart from Me, one can do nothing...human power is of use at all. A faithful, humble servant is what I who listens to all I teach Him, and then teaches it to another. Only those, who have ears to hear, are given to teach. To the rest, it is not given, for they do strive in vain, walking not next to Me, holding My hand, laying upon My breast. Rather, these men of vanities, of which you have spoken, walk among men and the earthly churches, built up by human power, seeking after human praise, elevated and uplifted in their own egos...they shall be brought VERY low, abased in the sight of others, and by this, alone, shall they come into glory. By no other means shall these high-minded come to know Me as I truly am, according to the true grace and truth I offer them...yet they will not come, for they have made Me in their own image, and have forgotten their Maker and His Law, and all that I have commanded them.
Beloved, the churches have all gone out of the way, and do wander wheresoever the world leads them. This has become enmity with God, for they no longer have ears to hear, and refuse the Father's correction and will not obey His commandments, and have forgotten even all His decrees, of which He has said they should keep, making my sacrifice into a perversion of faces, using My name and glory as a proverb of which I despise, even unto the proliferation of sin, excused in My own name...desecration!

Trent, My beloved, I have called unto you, and you have harkened. For you have endeavored to become completely virgin, as I have called Timothy, who was virgin according to doctrine, an empty vessel, meet for the Master's use. And in like manner, are you also becoming, even very quickly now. And you also will come to hear Me as Timothy hears, for you hear Me already from within, even deep within the recesses of your heart, where I have come to dwell.
I have made you and continue in your formation, until the Day comes when you are united to Me, and we become one, just as the Father and I are One. In that Day, no longer will you ask anything of Me at all, for you will be where I am, and I will be perfected in you and you in Me. And when you call to Me, I will answer before you have finished speaking, and your knowledge of Me will fill you as your blood fills your veins, wherein is life, of which I am.

You ask of Me questions, of which others think not of, even questions from deep within your conscious. Beloved, you know the answers already. Yet of this question, you think too deeply. Look simply and in faith, Trent, My son, and what do you see? ...
I have come to minister and not to be ministered unto. I came to heal the sick, even to all those who were in need of the Physician...beloved, I bore their infirmities. By no means did I, Myself, become sick, for the Father allowed nothing to keep Me from My mission, in the fulfillment of all that was written. I came as you, in flesh, to live as you, and to be fully tempted as you, yet I did not suffer illness of the body. For men do not realize that the Father made the body and mind to be one; and in this, He made them to not suffer illness but to abide in health. So as I came from the Father, and the Father is in Me, and I am in the Father, so also was My body in like manner, the body of which even Adam owned and would have kept to this Day, if he had not transgressed. All those, without sin, live forever and suffer not. And so I was without sin and abide forever, and came to carry the infirmities of those who came to Me in faith, asking that I should heal them. In the same way, I carried their sin, though I had no part in sin Myself. How can one, who is in need of a physician, heal others? Or one, who has sinned, bear and forgive the sins of another? Trent, I was completely clean, so by this, you and all those who seek Me, might also be clean. Remember and understand My words, spoken and written down in the Scriptures of Truth: No man takes My life from Me, but I lay it down of Myself. I have the power to lay it down, and I have the power to take it up again. This commandment have I received of My Father...

I am, and will always be, the perfect Lamb without spot or blemish
given up for many...

I am the restoration of all things.

*Read more Letters From God and His Christ by
clicking here-->

Trent's Comment:

Tim and readers,

There is so much I want to say in response, but I'll gear this message to those who may have doubt as to the authenticity, and for those among them that would like to hear validation from someone to which at least one letter is addressed.

Before I begin, let me first say that my name is mentioned and I was the one that asked the question, but the response is written to all those that have ears to hear ... so I am not the only recipient. If your heart leaps and is softened and welcomes the truth of this letter, as well as the other letters, then it is written to you and for you. And you along with all others that have ears are the true recipients of the letters, not merely any person that is called by name within the letter.

I imagine that parts of the letter seem specially worded to impact you, as this is true for me of many letters. I often ask, "how can such sweet expression be written, so familiar and special and meaningful to me?" and that is true of a great number of these letters ... and even more true of certain letters such as this one. Let me explain what I mean, by commenting about certain expressions in this letter ... but by no means can I fully talk about all the parts of this letter that is meaningful to me ... just the highlights.

1) it is written: "... in the times to come shall I bring you riches of the kind you have not known, of the kind that shall bring a multitude into My joy."

My wife and I are preoccupied in this stage in our life to move from consumers of goods to financiers of the Lord's work. We are concluding a long negotiation to sell intellectual property so that we can take in payments of royalties. We have gone into debt to survive the negotiation process and have negative net-worth ... yet in our lack ... we have heard the whispers of hope from the Lord and have peace that passes understanding that it will work out and a new future awaits us where we can begin giving away the wealth that could come with the inventions that we want to market. Indeed the inventions popped into our heads and we view them as a gift that belongs to The Lord Jesus anyway, so we are glad to see what may come from them.

2) it is also written: "Seek on, and serve Me in all patience and steadfastness of faith, with all long-suffering for those who know not Me and resist My Word."

I am given the patience to seek and serve alongside those that want nothing to do with the Letters ... because of their own prejudice and corruption of beliefs ... and this instruction is a timely reminder to continue with patience for them ...and for the sake of their willing spirits that will turn to the Lord in His timing.

3) it is also written: "For they go their own way, and closely adhere to all doctrines of men and the churches, endeavoring to teach others on My behalf, where in they go astray and do greatly err. For that which they have wrought in the Word, according to the traditions of men, is a rewriting of the Word spoken in Truth, of which none shall change."

I'll just say that I am nearly positive that I know the person (a friend) that this is about.

4) it is also written: "For if they taught others, according to that doctrine which is true, then, by this, they would know that the teacher, who has received of Me and of those gifts given by My own Spirit, teaches not by speaking, but by listening and by example, walking beside Me, holding My hand. And then, when those with sincere hearts come inquiring of Me, then, those who are given to teach, shall only speak that which I, Myself, have spoken to them."

It has been a recent meditation of mine how one can walk with sincerity and quietly live an example, rather than take a platform and set one's self up as an authority of teaching to be heard. And this explains how God's plan of influence is the reverse of the churches ... which has no power, and only man made authority. Those that quietly walk the walk, have seekers sent to them to bring them along, by speaking what the Spirit would have them say. While those that take the initutive to set themselves up as speakers are worthless to God ... having the frustration of nobody sent to them ... so they go out and find an audience that isn't seeking and only listens with dull ears. May their dullness protect them from such a message, as such a wayward sheep would only make a disciple twice-fit for hell anyway.

5) it is also written: "A faithful, humble servant is what I who listens to all I teach Him, and then teaches it to another. Only those, who have ears to hear, are given to teach. To the rest, it is not given, for they do strive in vain, walking not next to Me, holding My hand, laying upon My breast."

I addressed much of this above, but the last part about "laying upon My breast" may seem strange to many readers. To me, it is a personal thing. One of the most touching passages to me personal, in the Gospels is found in John's 13th chapter: verse 23 """Now there was leaning on Jesus' bosom one of his disciples, whom Jesus loved."""

I have often read this verse in astonishment and glee ... and made a silent and heartfelt prayer to the Lord that I could be as this disciple, and just enjoy the Lord in such a tender way ... laying upon Him, reclined and at peace ... even at the last supper. It has been something I dare not say, because I didn't think anybody would understand what I was talking about, and yet here it is in the letter, in black and white.

6) for brevity ... skipping down a bit ... it is written: "And when you call to Me, I will answer before you have finished speaking, and your knowledge of Me will fill you as your blood fills your veins, wherein is life, of which I am."

Anyone familiar with my writing at ... will recognize this statement as something I would often write, when inspired by Him. Even beyond that, is subtleties that I could not put to words quite so elegantly as it is written here, so beautifully.

7) it is written: "Trent, I was completely clean, so by this, you and all those who seek Me, might also be clean."

As the question gets addressed, I am amazed at how simple and elegant the answer flows and effaces my question that I have kept with me and pondered for so long. And as I read the answer, there is nothing left to ponder, and I see clear as day ... clear as these eyes can see in a mid-day sunlight. Ah-Ha! Amen! I see know. And I believe!

Thank you Lord Jesus!

Well, I hope this abbreviated reply is of assistance to all who read this letter and are blessed by it. And may Timothy be likewise encouraged that He has wrought the Lord's message to me and to others that may not have had the opportunity to say so.

Ripening for the harvest,


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Comment from: pam [Visitor]
Hi Trent,

I know I probably give Him a pain in the neck a good deal of the time...

Jesus wept. Jesus prayed to the Father in apparent agony to prevent Him from having to die as a sacrifice but then submitted to His Father. Near the moment of His death, He cried out, "My God, My God, Why have you forsaken me!" Any of us who love God but suffer great pain will cry out in much the same manner. I can't read these accounts and think that Jesus never suffered pain. Yes, He is sinless and lived a sinless life on the earth. He is all God but He is also all man. Because He lived in the flesh, He suffered all of the weakness of flesh yet, because He is the only begotten Son of God, His weak flesh did not cause Him to step outside of the perfect Will of His Father. His cleaness is not in perfection of His flesh but in the power of the Spirit over that flesh that is only gained by full submission. Jesus, when He walked the earth, was so submitted to His Father as to be God upon the earth. God Who suffered as a man that we might be saved.

Permalink 07/30/07 @ 20:56
Comment from: Len Hummel [Visitor] ·
Yes. Timothy is a gifted and humble servant of the Lord Jesus Christ. May GOD grant him protection and guidance in all that he does.

thanks for posting this excellent teaching message, Trent.
Permalink 08/01/07 @ 07:59
Comment from: servant [Visitor]
visitor pam...

I think the words above stated that Jesus never got sick, not that He never endured pain, because its obvious He did.
To be the unspotted Lamb He had to be completely clean.
What you read into it is apples and oranges. Jesus suffering pain - yes ...illness - no. Rather He bore OUR imfirmities, not His own, as it says in Isaiah. And this is the same is how He also bore our sins having never sinned - completely blameless.
Permalink 08/01/07 @ 13:17
Comment from: pam [Visitor]
If He bore our infirmities didn't He also indure them? To be human is to suffer from the weakness of our flesh that is prone to disease. Jesus was all God but He was also all man. I know there is no written record of his being sick but neither do I recall any written record of Him not being sick. Sickness is the result of being born into a world that is under the curse of sin and death. Illness can be the result of sin but not always. I suffer illnesses that are the direct result of sins I've commited. I know Jesus did not suffer that kind of illness for He never sinned but I'm not so sure that he never had a cold or a head ache. Jesus suffered whatever God appointed to Him to suffer and He did so in perfect obedience that is His complete surrender. Isn't that our calling also? I am not working toward my own perfection but God is working in me to perfect Christ in me. Christ's flesh was perfected when He arose from the dead and appeared in His glorified body. That too will be my final state but in this life, I suffer in my flesh, the very body of death. Jesus also wore that body of death. The perfection of Christ on the earth was His perfect obedience not a perfect body.

Permalink 08/01/07 @ 14:40
Comment from: Trent [Member] ·
Had Jesus not been conceived by the Holy Spirit, and had He therefore been in a fleshly tabernacle that was in the linage of fallen man - Adam, then perhaps you would have a case to be made ...
You and I were born under a curse from the sins of our fore-father - Adam. Jesus was born not from the fallen man, but begotten of the Father - sinless, and as Adam was before the fall.
Do you see?

Permalink 08/01/07 @ 21:00
Comment from: Trent [Member] ·
Listen with an open mind.

The Lord Jesus was not subjected to the curse, but gladly took it - as an act of love, not as something that was unavoidable ... and here is the curse:
Genesis 3:16-20 (New International Version)
16 To the woman he said,

"I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing;
with pain you will give birth to children.
Your desire will be for your husband,
and he will rule over you."

17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate from the tree about which I commanded you, 'You must not eat of it,'
"Cursed is the ground because of you;
through painful toil you will eat of it
all the days of your life.

18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
and you will eat the plants of the field.

19 By the sweat of your brow
you will eat your food
until you return to the ground,
since from it you were taken;
for dust you are
and to dust you will return."

Born of a virgin, this did not apply to the Lord Jesus.

Permalink 08/01/07 @ 21:04
Comment from: pam [Visitor]
Hi Trent,

I agree that Jesus was sinless. Only sinless blood would meet the requirements of sacrifice. However, if it were in the flesh itself that Jesus was perfect, then all the world would be attracted to Him for that is what attracts the world, perfect health, happiness, wealth, all of the things that Jesus was not. Instead of what I have to say about it, I offer these scriptures and there are quite a few.

Isaiah 53:1-16 Who has believed our message and to whom has the arm of the LORD been revealed? He grew up before him like a tender shoot, and like a root out of dry ground. He had NO BEAUTY OR MAJESTY to attract us to him, NOTHING IN HIS APPEARANCE that we should desire him. He was despised and rejected by men, A MAN OF SORROWS, AND FAMILIAR WITH SUFFERING. like one from whom men hide their faces he was despised, and we esteemed him not. SURELY HE TOOK UP OUR INFIRMITIES AND CARRIED OUR SORROWS, yet we considered him stricken by God, smitten by him, and afflicted. But he was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was upon him, and by his wounds we are healed. We all, like sheep, have gone astray, each of us has turned to his own way; and the LORD has laid on him the iniquity of us all.

Please notice that there is the description of him that differs from the description of what he bore for us.

Hebrews 4:14-5:1-2 Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has gone through the heavens, Jesus the Son God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. For we do not have a high prienst who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, BUT WE HAVE ONE WHO IS TEMPTED IN EVERY WAY, JUST AS WE ARE--YET WITHOUT SIN. Let us then approach the throne of grace with confidence, so that we may recieve mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need. Every high priest is selected from among men and is appointed to represent them in matters related to God, to offer gifts and sacrifices for sins. HE IS ABLE TO DEAL GENTLY WITH THOSE WHO ARE IGNORANT AND ARE GOING ASTRAY, SINCE HE HIMSELF IS SUBJECT TO WEAKNESS.


Yes, Jesus was born of a virgin fathered by God through the Holy Spirit but it was His submission that made Him sinless. He was all God and all man. His diety is often stressed to the exclusion of His humanity but it is both that make Him Jesus the Christ, the only begotten Son of God and Son of Man.

1 Cor.15:44-54 If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. So it is written: "The first man Adam became a living being" the last Adam, a life giving spirit. The spiritual did not come first, but the natural,and after that the spiritual. The first man was of the dust of the earth, the second man from heaven. As was the earthly man, so are those who are of the earth; and as is the man from heaven, so also are those who are of heaven. And just as we have borne the likeness of the earthly man, so shall we bear the likeness of the man from heaven. I declare to you, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishiable inherit the imperishable. Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will be changed--in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable,and the mortal with immortality. When the perisable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: "Death has been swallowed up in victory"

In more modern language, Jesus is a prototype of a new kind of man. He was born of a virgin but Mary was of the dust as the first Adam and Jesus bore his image through His mother. Yet, being born of the Spirit, He also was the express image of God. Also consider that the Jews of His time considered themselves not to be born in sin, of fornication, but to also be the sons of God. Yet, Jesus told them that they were of their father the devil for it was he that they obeyed. Jesus, though the Son of Man, was also the true Son of God by the very same principle, His complete submission to the Father. It was by this perfect submission that He conquered death and became a life giving spirit. Upon His resurrection, His flesh was glorified and there was no separation of flesh and Spirit, all had been made one in Christ Jesus. We too will be glorified in such a manner when we awake with the likeness of Christ. There is no seperation of body and spirit in the glorified man as is so commony taught by many preachers and teachers.

This is important for the mark of those who are of the antichrist do not deny the deity of Christ but deny that Jesus came in the flesh. There are many today (and have been from the beginning of the church) who will ascent to a spiritual Christ or Christ within but deny Jesus the Son of Man.

Jesus Christ is ALL God and ALL man.

This doesn't mean that I think you and Timothy are antichrist, I promise. ;-)

Permalink 08/02/07 @ 00:22
Comment from: Trent [Member] ·
Sister, this is a quarrel over words. See beyond the words to the heart of the matter.

Adam was human before he sinned and after he sinned.
To say that Jesus was sinless and abode in the quality of flesh that Adam had before the fall, is not saying that Jesus was non-human.

If anything, the fallen/corrupt man is sub-human, and therefore to posit to the Lord Jesus (at His coming) the curse of sin, though He was born of a virgin, is closer to calling Him sub-human than anything that I have said, IMHO.

Yes Jesus is ALL man, more-so than any other person that was born of man - for He was not born of man, but of God - sinless, so that He was not cursed, until He voluntarily became a curse by hanging on the tree.
What curse applies to the pure and holy, brimming with life divine? Amen, He was ALL man ... and if you even meet Someone that is likewise, then I encourage you to touch the hem of His garment.

Permalink 08/02/07 @ 03:59
Comment from: Len Hummel [Visitor] ·
If I may just add a couple quick thoughts to this issue:

"He learned obedience *through the things which he suffered..." [and OVERCAME]. - but this does NOT imply that he suffered illness. - he "suffered the contradiction of sinners," - scorn, contempt, misunderstanding, hate, betrayal, railing, ... and finally: the Cross and punishment for the sins of the world.

But Jesus, being perfect in every way, did NOT suffer illness, NOR was he subject to the curse of viruses, germs, disease, or malfunction or dysfuction.
He was [and IS] THE PERFECT Second Adam: Son of GOD and Son of Man.

Permalink 08/02/07 @ 05:19
Comment from: pam [Visitor]
Hi Trent and Len,

I'd like to not think of this as a quarrel but simply that of fellow believers trying to come to a greater understanding of God's truth.

The Bible is truly silent on the 'issue' of whether or not Jesus ever had a cold or a headache. It is not silent on the importance of Jesus as the Son of Man, suffering as we suffer yet, without sin.

Permalink 08/02/07 @ 10:07
Comment from: Yeshua's servant [Visitor]
To Pam (visitor):

The issue is not that you or Trent or Len is right or wrong. Rather it is that Jesus, The Lord, has answered this question in His own words and you have not believed.

Therefore, your argument has been with the Lord from the onset and not with His servants...

The Lord has spoken!...Heed His WORD....
cease from your pride and humble yourself before Him and give Him glory!

Anyone who believes not this Word and refuses to believe it, seeking their OWN way, holding fast to their OWN understanding and the doctrines of men shall be corrected and disciplined...
'as the Lord corrects and disciplines even all those He loves'; even you, who has now been found contending not with men, but the Lord, even to the denying and fighting against His Word.

Shall then He reward you for this?...

REPENT and the Lord shall surely fill you with understanding...not as men or the world gives.
Permalink 08/05/07 @ 01:51
Comment from: pam [Visitor]
I'm sorry if it comes across as trying to prove someone right or wrong or myself right. I repent from acting upon hurt feelings that would equate the suffering of illness with the suffering of sin, as the Pharisees did. I should have thought before I responded but then again, that goes to my first point of often giving Jesus a pain in the neck.;-}

However, the rest of what I posted is scripture and I can find no scripture that says that Jesus, the Son of Man, never suffered physical illness. I do know however, that He has suffered all that I suffer and I have suffered a lot of physical illness. If not for Jesus, His compassion and empathy, that is only born out of like suffering, I would have become only a bitter and angry old woman long ago but Jesus gives me joy to endure the crucible of my ill health and also the joy of knowing that like Him, I am being perfected in my suffering. All that I endure is that Christ be formed in me and when I am resurrected and receive my glorified body, I will be just like Him. This is the experience of Jesus in my life, Jesus where the rubber meets the road and not a matter of right and wrong. He is my life and He is the Life. He is all God and all man. He judges the thoughts and intents of my heart especially, the ones I am not able to judge for myself.

I judge my intent as being that of clarifying the truth and not arguing. I hope Jesus finds the same intent. If not, He'll let me know that His neck is hurting again and straighten me out!

Permalink 08/07/07 @ 16:04
Comment from: Yeshua's servent [Visitor]
visitor Pam,

Do you believe the above Word (Letter) is from the mouth of Jesus through one of His modern day prophets as it states?

Please answer truthfully, for If you believe I have an answer to one of your prayers...if not, pray and ask of the Lord to reveal to you if indeed this is His Word and then listen in all faith and He will answer you.

You said, "All that I endure is that Christ be formed in me and when I am resurrected and receive my glorified body, I will be just like Him."

Amen...come Lord Jesus.

Sister know this: That Day in which your suffering departs from you is coming far sooner than you realize...for you shall not be raised to life at the Last Day as one among those who sleep, rather you will be awake and caught up with those who are alive and remain.

Believe this word, for I write this to you not of myself, but of the One, Who I serve and has commanded me to say these things. Take much comfort, for in your humility the Lord is well pleased and of your repentance the Lord has accepted and in turn will bless you with that you have not looked for, but desire... if you believe it is He who speaks in the Letter above.

Permalink 08/07/07 @ 22:56
Comment from: pam [Visitor]
I don't know if this is the place for me to discuss this fully...I will say that I believe that the last days began when Christ ascended and the Bible says that in the last days, God will pour out His Spirit upon all and our sons and daughters would prophesy. In Hebrews, we are taught that God speaks to us now through His Son, Jesus. Jesus taught that we are all brethren, with one teacher, Christ. In my heart of hearts, I believe that every believer in Christ is a prophet, when we speak as we should, as the oracles of God. I do not believe in speacial persons in Christ, for all are made equal in Christ, there is no division, and He only is the Head. Any gifting we receive is not for our glory and even as the church is commonly arranged today with special persons held up as leaders or stars or more holy, I don't find to be Biblical. I am not sure about the modern day prophet concept because that can mean so many things and I am old enough that I take things very slowly and wait for God to reveal them to me. I also am unsure about equating the writing with scripture. I don't understand the reason for it. I see much good in what I've read but also have read some things that trouble me, that don't line up exactly as I understand scripture, anway. I can only accept that which God leads me to accept as true just as He opens my eyes to scripture as I am ready to receive it and understand it.

Hmmm, I desire and end to deception both my own and of others. I desire that all would have Jesus revealed to them and I know this will be but in the mean time, I yet live in a world of deception and my safety is in Jesus and in waiting upon that which He reveals to me to be true, in His time.

However God decided to take me, I will surrender to. I used to look for His coming as an escape hatch but not so in the last few years. I don't want to suffer as doctors tell me is likely but if that is what I'm to endure, He will enable me. That doesn't mean I don't whine about it sometimes but even in that weakness, somehow, He draws me closer. Any tribulation we are called to endure, He will enable us and also enable us to accept it as God's Will just as He enabled Jesus to endure the cross and give his earthly life as sinless sacrifice that upon His bodily resurrection, He could impart Life to a dying world. Whether I be taken up, suffer and then sleep to be bodily resurrected later, or remain through the final season of evil, Jesus will be with me and that is enough. Truly, I know this is true even when I am weak and cry and wail. Jesus wept also and that was as the Son of Man for God is never hopeless and has no need for tears, He is able to harvest all that He desires, but I believe, that Jesus wept for He suffered the same weakness that I also suffer yet, He also bore the character of the Son of God, that Spirit that enabled Him to endure. By adoption, we also enjoy that same sweet enabling by the power of the Holy Spirit that indwells us. We too have become man and God in Jesus Christ. Our flesh will not be consumed but fully glorified.

Permalink 08/07/07 @ 23:28
Comment from: pam [Visitor]
I also want to add to this that I do not know the hour or the season of His coming. No man or woman knows. Jesus said that He does not even know but the Father only. I do know that I should learn from the fig tree and be ready to answer the call of my Savior when it is not in season to do so. He will come like a theif in the night when none are looking for His arrival, it is then that I must be prepared to meet Him.

Permalink 08/08/07 @ 10:23
Comment from: pam [Visitor]
Even when I read the Bible, I come across things that don't fit with my understanding that I have to cross check and ask the Spirit to reaveal to me the meaning. Timothy's words are sweet and in them is a great deal of Truth but there are a couple of points that trouble me even though they sound very good to me and that is when I must go to scripture to see how they measure there. I must return to that great cloud of witness that has gone before and by what God has written through them test all the spirits. Testing can be a very long process, Timothy. That is the best I can do but I do promise to be faithful to continue testing the words and as best as I am capable online, to observe your actions.

I guess in the end, this is a very complicated way of saying, "I don't know."

Permalink 08/08/07 @ 10:39
Comment from: Yeshua's servent [Visitor]
Though you still resist His Word and believe not, holding fast to your own understanding placing your wisdom above the Lord's... yet the Lord has spoken.
So pray and receive of Him and His answer. He wishes to show you something, of which, I cannot repeat, rather I leave it with Him to give to you according to the good pleasure of His will.

You have been and remain in my prayers.
Permalink 08/08/07 @ 10:59
Comment from: pam [Visitor]
Please look again to Hebrews 5:7-10.

Jesus cried to the One Who was able to keep Him alive. These are the cries of Jesus the Son of Man. He taught us that the Son of Man has power to forgive sins upon the earth and thereby, many are healed but all healing is of the Father, He who governs our very breath.

Jesus the Son of God was with the Father from before the beginning, the only one who knows the Father intimately, the One through Whom the Father created all things and in Whom all things are held together. In Him, we are becoming to know our Father intimately.

This perfect Son of God took on the form of imperfect flesh, Fathered by the Holy Spirit and born of a woman of the lineage of Adam. He suffered all the weakness of the flesh according to His earthly lineage but He also bore the image and character of His Father and by the Spirit, brought that flesh into full submission to His Heavenly Father. Thereby that flesh was redeemed; perfected and made holy as the Son of God is holy and perfect. In Christ, we pass through the same spiritual process that redeems our flesh and that full redeemption will be manefest upon resurrection when we receive our glorified bodies. Jesus the first fruit and then we at His coming.

This will not be true of the antichrists. They will present as perfected flesh in their own strength claiming to be God. They perform many wonders and will not deny the deity of Christ but declare it even for themselves yet, they will deny and even despise Jesus the Son of Man and seek to destroy all who are of His lineage by the power of the Holy Spirit. Those who are of the lineage of Adam yet, Spiritually reborn. Though you hear, this is the Christ! No! Over here! Don't go in either direction for the christ that will be adored during the full season of evil is not Jesus, The Son of Man, the Son of God. He truly is the son of the god of this world and by the perfection and wonder of his flesh and godlike arrogance empowered by that perfect flesh, many will be decieved, afraid, and they will wonder after him. They will be of his lineage and he their father and they will be numbered according to his name.

Though Jesus speaks to us who are His, other spirits speak to us too and seek to deceive us and if it were possible, they would deceive even the elect. God however, is faithful and to each of us He has given the Holy Spirit to teach us and His Holy Word as a guide and in these we are safe from deception. When we, and I included, puff ourselves up with our own knowledge and ideas, we are deceived already.

We do better to love more and talk less and when we talk, I pray that all of our words would be seasoned with salt that the words spoken from God would always remain. This is the test of all we do or say, that which is of God will remain and that which is hay and stubble will burn away. That is a wonderful blessing from God and makes room for any pride of owenership when His good work is accomplished through us, despite us.:0)

I think my flow of words have finally ceased...whew!

God's Full Blessing,
Permalink 08/08/07 @ 11:14
Comment from: pam [Visitor]
No, Timothy, I am waiting to receive the Lord's wisdom in this matter. I don't want my heart to deceive me for He and I know what makes me vulnerable. He also tells me that you are young Timothy as I was once young. That does not hinder God's work through you but you have much yet to be taught through that working, as I do also. Trent is young also. I can't find the words for what I desire to say, they are but inward groans. I will give them to God in my prayers that the Holy Spirit might interpret them. Sons never listen to their mothers for they know that as men, in their newly aquired adult strength, they will rule over them.

Permalink 08/08/07 @ 12:44
Comment from: pam [Visitor]
I apologize to everyone. I am overly emotional and sensitive right now.

Permalink 08/08/07 @ 17:41
Comment from: pam [Visitor]
The forms of things can be so deceptive and their power of deception lies in their familiarity and our assoication with them. I like everyone else, do not like to be deceieved. In the weakness of my flesh I look for the correct content in the familiar form so that I may keep myself from falling to deception and in that I have erred. The form in which Timothy presented himself threw me off for his form is one I associate with deception. I hear 'modern day prophet', I think 'Joesph Smith', 'Benny Hin', 'David Koresh', and I have immediate expectation of what will follow. I expect 'Timothy' to be exalted above other believers and to gather a following. I have been blinded by the form and have not been able to see the content. I now see Timothy as a brother and though I don't understand why God has called him to be presented in this form, prophet as in the OT sense of the word, I do now accept his sincerity. I desire now to hear his words without seeing the form and I will listen for the voice of Jesus in those words. I still do not know Timothy well and this is a process that takes time but I will endevour to have a more open mind toward him because I don't want to miss anything the Lord may have for me.

I am sorry for any dicension or confusion I may have caused. My desire was not to divide brothers but as always, to point to Christ and to Him I have been divided away from all, even family and often, even other believers. I am not lifting Timothy as anything, for he is just a man, but I am publically acknowleging him as my brother in Christ and apologizing for anything I may have done to deminish God's work throgh him.

Permalink 08/09/07 @ 15:33

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